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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
 Posted - 04 Sep 2004 : 9:22:46 PM
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I have had a coulpe of calls about whether the HMRAV would consider splitting the classes and perhaps running the 350's with the 250's instead of the 500's. The reason given is that a number of people have 350 and 500 machines. What are your thoughts, do you have details of what extra machines could race if this was done?
Now I am getting calls to separate the 250 and 350 Forgotten Era machines, can you let us know what can be done. Overall we need to have good numbers of machines in each class to run a race with at least 10 machines, bearing in mind the limited num,ber of races we can have and the number of bikes turning up.
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John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
Edited by - john on 23 Sep 2004 10:56:32 AM |
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keith campbell
Level 3 Member
Victoria
248 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2004 : 3:31:55 PM
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All classes "should" sustain enough entries to have it's own race at a "special" race meeting with the History of the "Southern Classic".
There are bikes available "out" there but it may be a problem with the S.A. meeting clash to get those entries here in Victoria this year.
Perhaps in the future a program of events including all classes promoting Junior,Senior and Unlimited as separate events for "Classics" will bring extra bikes to these meetings.People need to speak up and or be asked at the meetings what they think because it could be possible not all classic racers are "on-line" and know nothing about what is being said here.
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2004 : 7:33:32 PM
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| Currently we have 6 350 Classic and 12 500cc machines entered. I agree we do need to ask around and I would take on board to the committee any details that can be gleaned at the Southern Classic. Perhaps something could be asked at the saturday trophy session. Go for it Keith please! |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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keith campbell
Level 3 Member
Victoria
248 Posts |
Posted - 09 Sep 2004 : 11:37:46 AM
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Certainly John and i also intend to "interrogate" the riders at the meeting with a Q&A sheet about riders known but not present at the Sthn Classic if that is o.k?
Perhaps I could mention it at the riders briefing each day for completion by any interested parties. |
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Former Member
deleted
174 Posts |
Posted - 09 Sep 2004 : 12:40:07 PM
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Maybe we should nut out a Q+A sheet to be posted out with newsletters as well.
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Its not what you ride,Its how fast you ride it!!! |
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keith campbell
Level 3 Member
Victoria
248 Posts |
Posted - 09 Sep 2004 : 1:03:26 PM
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| My early thoughts have been to get Names,Type of bike/s raced,last raced at,club name and any contact details known so far .... |
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keith campbell
Level 3 Member
Victoria
248 Posts |
Posted - 09 Sep 2004 : 1:12:55 PM
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Another thought is to have the P.A. commentary giving people an earfull at every opportunity mentioning there is a desire to have more competitors on the track and any interested parties should consider filling out the sheets in the for example: Scrutineers shed,Canteen,Bonnett of the Ambo in pit lane????? Wherever suits.......I dunno tell me what you think.
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 09 Sep 2004 : 3:22:15 PM
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This all sounds almost as good as the rumble from my sidecar exhaust system we need more of it. I have put the question to the newsletter, Keith some talking at the track is perfect and elsewhere. Perhaps the Q and A should also ask them why aren't they on a sidecar!!
Seriously, we all know why anyway.
But more seriously any feedback is great because we can only take steps if we have the info on hand. Maybe when the truth syryp starts to flow we will get the real reason the 350 and 500 fields are down. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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keith campbell
Level 3 Member
Victoria
248 Posts |
Posted - 09 Sep 2004 : 5:07:12 PM
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| As per last years "truth syrup" sessions in the pits on Fri & Sat nights I have every intention of having another go.....can't wait. |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 10 Sep 2004 : 7:25:23 PM
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| are we finally moving towards continual improvement? A customer survey is an excellent idea, provided you don't do it too often, so it's important to get the Q&A form right first time. |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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keith campbell
Level 3 Member
Victoria
248 Posts |
Posted - 11 Sep 2004 : 08:04:50 AM
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Don't miss my point here I am looking for riders not present at this meeting and their details.
I am interested in the "other" survey which must come all too soon with the riders contribution vitally important to the continuance of racing according to the impression i am getting about this "philosophy" stuff.... |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 11 Sep 2004 : 2:35:39 PM
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| Contiual development has nothing to do with thsi topic Al, we are trying to find if we can get more bikes by splitting the field. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 22 Sep 2004 : 8:48:39 PM
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We have had the 125 riders put a case for Vintage, Classic up to 250 and all 125 in the one event.
Today I was told the separation of the 250 Classic from the 350 was a good step. But that rider is off the the Vincent International Rally. Are other riders interested about the separation of the 250 from the 350. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 24 Sep 2004 : 9:03:07 PM
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John, the P5 two stroke races I saw recently at PI and Broadford were probably the closest thing I've seen to racing as it really was back then (top stuff). If you are splitting classes to get more opportunity for certain guys to have a win, I suggest you should always try to get a full grid. It is also worthwhile trying to get the guys competitive with each other, so they are in a bunch going for it.
When you run a grid of ten to 15 bikes and they're all spread out, the spectators will simply yawn and go home. |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 24 Sep 2004 : 11:52:17 PM
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| Al, with respect can we sticvk to Classics on this topic. I need to keep an eye on this topic at the moment and the F / E will get its turn when the P ? classics have been discussed. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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mboddy
Level 2 Member
Australian Capital Territory
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26 Posts |
Posted - 26 Sep 2004 : 09:48:28 AM
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PCRA (NSW) meetings have been running 125 & 250 Post Classic and Forgotten Era together in a race but with separate point score. 350 and above Post Classic in a race with separate point score. 350 and above Forgotten Era in a race with separate point score.
This format results in many riders racing both 250 and 350 Forgotten Era or both 250 and 350 Post Classic.
For example, the first four place getters in 250 Forgotten Era at the NSW Titles also race 350 Forgotten Era.
For a rider, running both classes gives twice as many races per meeting and puts more bikes on the track. At the last PCRA meeting I entered 250, 350 and 369cc RDLC Yamahas and was entered in 14 races in one day! When Lech broke a rod I loaned him my 369cc to race.
With 350 Forgotten Era growing (as is evidenced by the number at this years Island Classic) it was bought up at the PCRA AGM the possibility of running 350 Forgotten Era and Post Classic together in future if the numbers support it.
I see 250 and 350 Forgotten Era as the two growth classes in Historic Racing. I talk to people all the time who approach me about racing in these classes. They don't say that they would be racing if only blah blah blah. They say that they are currently building RDLC race bikes.
Also, we have more TZ350s being setup for racing in NSW.
This year myself, Lech B and Bill M, all bought TZ350s which we are slowly getting together. Richard E keeps offering to buy my TZ as he wants to race one. Craig Morris started racing a TZ250 and TZ350 this year.
Now that TZ250 pistons are being remanufactured by Yamaha we should see more TZ250s on the track.
PCRA (NSW) have a good formula and I believe that it will pay off for them more and more as time goes by.
I believe that Victorian meetings would be wise to nurture these two classes.
The main reason that I don't go to the Island Classic these days is the up to 500 and over 500 split in the Forgotten Era Class. When I last raced at the Island Classic it was up to 350 and over 350 and so I built a 500 so that I could race a 350 and a 500.
Then they changed the split.
How about Victorian meetings running like PCRA (NSW) with 125 and 250 Post Classic and Forgotten Era together but with separate points.
My wife observes that typically the older bikes have the older riders and so this approach should work out better than the current class splits to get more riders on the track with two or more bikes.
Do you have so many spares for your race bike that you could almost build another one? Many RDLC and TZ riders find that this is the case.
The other great thing about running all 125 and 250 together is that it provides closer racing. They all have high corner speed and the Post Classic methanol fuel keeps them up with the Forgotten Era bikes.
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Edited by - mboddy on 26 Sep 2004 10:08:16 AM |
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steve
Level 2 Member
Queensland
86 Posts |
Posted - 29 Sep 2004 : 8:57:42 PM
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Hi All
Perod 3 is not the only period these days, I don't know how many times I've waited to go out racing & there is 3 or 4, 125 to 350cc going around & 30 to 40 post classic bikes bunched in to one race from 0 to 1300cc I didn't race at the last NSW meeting because if you had a Classic Bikes you got 17 racers & Post Classic you got 7 over the week-end. I raced in NZ & all "Classes" had reserves you were racing anything from GP125s to Manx, Tridents, Guzzi's across all periods (NON JAPS) one race had "32" Manx's in one race, all the International riders are happy with the NZ Classes but unhappy with OZ Classes as they break them up by CC Classes It makes more interesting racing for the riders & Spectators!! as it's more interesting to see full grids belting around, rather than 5 250s 4 350s 15 500s 5 over 500s all in different racers & at the end of the week-end you half that, & as soon as this point is addressed numbers will fall. I can see this being shouted down as normal as I'm "not" from "Vic"
Steve Qld |
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Alan
Forum Moderator
Western Australia
353 Posts |
Posted - 29 Sep 2004 : 9:42:48 PM
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At last something I can be positive about. We in the mighty west almost always combine capacity classes in the one race as we suffer from low numbers in most classes. We do make awards to the individual capacities so the smaller classes while being in the same race as larger categories are still only racing within their class, or against the clock depending on their individual perspective.
The safety factor is controlled by making sure that race lengths are such that an absolute minimum of lapping occurs and in some cases using staggered starts, timekeepers just love them.
Another option that we have tried that does work is to forget traditional categories and form grids based on lap times, this ensures that riders of similar speed run together and makes for a better spectacle.
Hope that helps a little.
Alan Sidecar 21 WA |
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steve
Level 2 Member
Queensland
86 Posts |
Posted - 30 Sep 2004 : 11:21:43 AM
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Hi
Yes Alan here in Qld we do the same & have 10sec delay for certain classes!! you could have 3 different classes & another 3 different cc areas in the same racers, great racing lots on the grids & spectators think it unreal just like it was in the old days!! "numbers" BOTH Riders & Spectators are happy, no one wants to watch a couple of bikes getting around they want to watch a good field & dices across the paddock!! Yes ego's get blown away & certain Classic fellows won't race in the mixed fields because they think it's dangerous! BEARS Racing comes to mind!! Eastern Creek in Feb had the idea 10sec apart 3 to 4 different start times full fields & a couple of people missed out because TOO MANY riders & you had as many racers as you wanted 14 in 53deg heat!!! NT Darwin is the same.
I say this again Classic Bikes are not the only people racing!!!!!!!!!!!!! Until people get even billing people will go elsewhere! & I see this across OZ!! but not in NZ or the US. Post Classic Riders are slowly getting equal time & the Fogotten Era fellows have gone mad more & more riders & bikes, Promoters see Dollar signs with full fields!! in Period 4 & 5 & this is/has happening. we acn see at the Phillip Island Classic, I seen the complaints already here, I'm not racing if the Classic bike dont get more racers than the rest!!
Steve
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