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David
Site Administrator
Australia
999 Posts |
 Posted - 07 Dec 2002 : 08:07:03 AM
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Hello,
Please be advised that David White (Chief Executive Officer) of MA has given permission for Classic Motorcycling Australia to have their Log Book Application directly for download from this site.
You must be logged in to see this link.
Classic Motorcycling Australia would like to thank You must be logged in to see this link. for making it easy for our users to find and be able to download the application to obtain their log books for 2003.
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Regards,
David
Webmaster & Owner of Classic Motorcycling Australia
Quote: I thought I wanted a career, turns out I just wanted to be paid. |
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Allan
Site Moderator
National
599 Posts |
Posted - 07 Dec 2002 : 08:33:54 AM
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| Yes we can save you money you now only have to fill in app form and post away to MA saves you a phone call so NO one should say o" could not get the form's from MA here they are just print the last 4 pages and fill them in with photo's of you bike |
Allan Greening |
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David
Site Administrator
Australia
999 Posts |
Posted - 02 Feb 2003 : 9:33:32 PM
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Hello,
I have had a request for me to print and send out the logbook application by a casual visitor (non member of these forums). This web site or I have no control over the application for the logbook. We are only providing a source for the application form.
If others require the application to be printed and mailed out to them, please contact MA (Motorcycling Australia) at You must be logged in to see this link.. I am only saying this, as it costs me more money out of my pocket. It may seem like it is only $0.45, but you need to consider, paper, ink and time to do these things before requesting this type of request.
I am only permitted to a certain amount of spending by the minister of finance (the wife) on this web site, and we have reached those limits.
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Regards,
David
Webmaster & Owner of Classic Motorcycling Australia
Quote: I thought I wanted a career, turns out I just wanted to be paid. |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 08 Dec 2003 : 7:39:12 PM
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Why do I need a log book? Does it have anything to do with eligibility? Will it stop my competition from running 1100cc Hondas in P4, or 750cc Triumphs and 850cc Nortons in P3? I believe the log book thing is a cr*ck of sh*t, until the eligibilty rules are fixed, and by the time we've done that we won't have a sport!
I suggest the $20 log book fee per bike is just another TAX, it serves no purpose, and it just makes an expensive sport MORE EXPENSIVE! |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 08 Dec 2003 : 7:45:24 PM
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I recently organised a successful historic car meeting at Winton. It was run under AAA, NOT CAMS. What this meant was that a REPLICA Mercedes W196 was able to run. It DOESN'T HAVE A LOG BOOK. That's what stopped it from running at any other historic meeting in Australia. The factory guys, and Stirling Moss have seen this car. They have said it looks authentic in every way. Stirling Moss even autographed the bodywork.
Log books can be used to manipulate what runs and what doesn't, by guys who should know better. The argument is that 'replicas dilute the sport'. What a load of B*LLSH*T!! |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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Former Member
deleted
174 Posts |
Posted - 09 Dec 2003 : 9:47:55 PM
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This log book fiasco is just a complete joke.
I beleive it only is a money making grab from you know who and is holding back the sport of historic racing.
Lets get more reps out there and fill up the grid,making it better from a racers,a flagmarshalls(god bless em),and the humble spectators point of view.
I think if this is not resolved real soon it will have a very negative effect on our sport. |
Its not what you ride,Its how fast you ride it!!! |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 10 Dec 2003 : 6:58:47 PM
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| Neill, which part is a joke? Most of us have got log books with some effort, some bikes are not perfect but it seems most blatent variations of class have been separated out. I have been told some are not perfect, and unfortunately we have to protest against them if we think they are wrong. But at least once we are over the initial implementation, dont your believe it may be better than having the situation we had earlier when discs were creeping into classics, four pot calipers instead of single, classic had down draught carbies etc.I am aware the transition is not complete and not perfect but lets work to get it working. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 13 Dec 2003 : 02:13:41 AM
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John, What is HMRAVs Mission and Vision for Historic Road Racing? Are we trying to be purist, or are we trying to recreate an era (or several eras) ? Are we trying to promote some new kind of racing using old bikes? Are we trying to promote some cheap entry level for up and coming kids to get into motorcycle sport, by using old bikes?
JUST WHAT ARE WE TRYING TO DO WITH THE SPORT? Surely this determines what we should do with the eligibility issues. If it's just about having fun we should be able to ride any old bike in any condition, as long as it's safe! If we just want cheap competition, we should all race RS125s, or VFR400s.
I don't think that's what historic racing is about! What do you think it's about? (Serious question this time!) |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 13 Dec 2003 : 09:56:13 AM
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| I have to admit Al, that we dont seem to have sat down and discussed it. I can say MV has a 5 year business plan.The Historic Management committee has been asked to review its discipline and we will soon be doing that. Unfirtunately it is not available in electronic form, but lets see if I can get it around. All submissions are most welcome |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 14 Dec 2003 : 7:27:31 PM
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John, I have a personal vision for historic road racing. I'd like to see the concept of 'periods' continued for championships, as I believe it is the basis of authenticity. However there is plenty of stuff racing which never existed in the form it's in now. In fact I'd go so far as to say none of the good specials like Rod Tingate's or Rene Van Dinteren's Rickman Triumphs now exist. They certainly wouldn't be competitive against Rex and his mates. But don't get me wrong Rex is where historic P4 is at now. I think we have to build on that rather than destroy.
I suggest we need to look constructively for more formulae such as the 750 pushrod class. That was a very good idea, and should encourage bikes more like waht was around.
Perhaps we should get all the old farts to write a description of various bikes which raced in the 'periods'. So there is actually some record of what was around. We seem to have lost the history a bit. Jim Scaysbrook's book (Australia's Motorcycling Heritage from Spagforth Press) was a shot in the arm. It provides a bit of a record backbone. I suggest we need to build on that. When we've got some sort of record, perhaps then we can look at what we want to do with the sport. It'd be good to get a few replicas of the real thing built and racing - the guys that had them are mainly still around. - Rod Tingate, Jack Ahearn, Maurie Quincey, Steve Oszko, Noel Mercer, George Huse, John Armstrong, John Maher, and plenty of others would all be worth questioning about their bikes. I believe Alec Henderson is still around.
Another book by Jim Scaysbrook on the real historic bikes with data and photos would be excellent! |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 14 Dec 2003 : 7:33:35 PM
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| Incidentally the races at Broadford with the small two strokes, actually looked like it was, back in the early 70s. More P4 and P5 two stroke races would be good. |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 15 Dec 2003 : 07:12:56 AM
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I've said a couple of things about Rex's bikes over the years. I recognise they are 'historic', however they are'nt really representative of P4. They are similar to the American Motorcycle Association racers of the mid- seventies. I had a talk to Tony Cacciotti a while back, and asked him about the Bill Patterson Honda CR750. He said that when Rex asked him to ride the bike, he had reservations, but when he tried he found them much easier to ride than he expected.
I haven't seen a CR750 kitted bike in years, and I wonder why noone has tried to build one? I believe it is because they are so peaky, and hard to ride with the meggas, race cams and clipons. I understand they used to have trouble with cam chains, probably due to the lumpy cams. I don't know what Rex uses, but he doesn't seem to have trouble. He seems to have come up with a good formula for a race bike.
I'd like to see someone out there with an authentic Honda 750 racer. Robin Gibsons idea of getting a 350 honda into race trim, is a good one, but I only ever saw one decent Honda 400 four back in the early seventies. The guy was an A Grader who rode it at Phillip Island a few times. He blitzed all the small two strokes. The bike was actually bored out to 500cc. It had clipons , fairing and four pipes.
Rex's bikes are a bit similar to Croz's Z900 of about 1974! |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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keith campbell
Level 3 Member
Victoria
248 Posts |
Posted - 15 Dec 2003 : 1:18:54 PM
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| What is Robin Gibsons vision? Also does anyone know if the bloke who put his xs650 pic. on recently turned up to B/Ford and encouraged to apply for a log book? |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2003 : 09:24:15 AM
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I would really try to avoid complaining about any bike running in historic events. It's hard enough just getting guys to run. Trouble is that ineligible bikes are a bit of a turn-off for the guys with anything a bit authentic.
I'm certainly not criticising Rex's efforts, I think he makes a bl**dy nice bike. They're within 'the rules', but their being there doesn't help anyone to bring out a CR750 replica. Rex's bikes would cack on one.
We need to look at the sort of races we are running, trouble is that as the fields are dwindling a bit, we don't seem to have too many options. |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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keith campbell
Level 3 Member
Victoria
248 Posts |
Posted - 22 Dec 2003 : 10:51:45 AM
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Isn't the limit already 1300cc?
If your bike is under this you are in?
The up to 750cc pushrod class ( run together? )has potential to grow doesn't it?
What about up to 750cc then over? |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 22 Dec 2003 : 7:38:41 PM
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Keith, The capacity rules in the old days were 350cc - Junior, 500cc - Senior, 750cc Formula 750, Unlimited was unlimited but effectively 1300cc. I believe there was a lightweight class of 250cc max, and an ultralightweight class of 125cc. These capacity classes were in common use throughout Europe. The Formula 750 class was never run in Australia. Effectively every bike raced up until the mid sixties was under 650cc except for the Vincents. Formula 750 was an early 70s class. My bike (Seeley Commando) is a replica of the Gus Kuhn F750 machine (except mine is 826cc).
The unlimited class creates a problem in Australia. Some P3 machines are using 850 Norton motors, and 750 triumphs - neither of these capacities were available pre 62. There were only ever two 750 Atlases sold by Modak, and the cylinder base flanges used to crack off. I think you'll find the atlases racing in P3 these days have 1972 Combat engines.
The whole thing is a bit of a cheat, particularly the bit about using 9 stud heads on P3 Triumphs- this allows motors to be bored to 730cc.
I believe all this stuff only helps to destroy the competitive and authentic aspects of the sport.
Actually I believe a Historic Formula 750 class would be a good addition to the sport. A genuine CR750 Honda, would find it hard to stay in front of a good 750 Triumph or Norton, the two strokes are the only problem.
Perhaps There should be different classes for two strokes and four strokes? |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 22 Dec 2003 : 7:49:44 PM
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| Incidently, as I said in another post, the two stroke races at Broady, the other weekend, took me back to the early 70s. In those days all the C graders had RD350s, the A graders rode TZ350s and TZ750s, and H2Rs. The BGraders rode Tzs and aircooled Yammies. The races I mentioned, were pretty close to a recreation of the era, something a bit unusual these days. It sort of brought a tear to the eye, they were the sort of races Blakey, Hansford and Toombs raced in. I actually found it a bit exciting. We should encourage more of the blokes to bring out these late 60s and 70s two strokes. When they run against each other (and not four strokes), they aren't half bad to watch. |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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keith campbell
Level 3 Member
Victoria
248 Posts |
Posted - 23 Dec 2003 : 12:07:50 PM
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The idea appeals in so far as to say "hopefully" owners of such machines can be encouraged to bring them out.With the way bikes are being modified to race today in a class that exisits and has good grids another must therefore be created.For anyone who has done whatever they can to their bikes eg 650cc out to 900cc or 750cc out to 1100cc could not be "encouraged" to go backwards.
I agree that it must be discouraging in some respects to not be as competitive as one would like but as time marches on things change.Tyres improve,brakes,chassis and suspension and engineering challenges are wrestled with.Obviously should any changes be considered that may ostricise current bikes that are often numbering large entries it could mean a substantial loss not only in revenue but great competitors also who have done plenty for their sport.Eg at some meets I've been to without the T-Rex's the grid would be half empty rather than FULL.
I only suggest that LOTS AND LOTS of consideration go into proposing changes that may only suit the few.....
This is not to say with proper instigation and consultation that perhaps ANOTHER class may bear fruit and flourish.I reckon a seriously committed group will have to apply themselves to get anything to happen though....... good luck.
As some meets show lots of people enter and others they dont- to make anything a success people HAVE TO GUARANTEE TO ENTER...EG PAY FOR EVENTS IN ADVANCE.
AT LEAST IF THEY PAY FOR EG. 3 HMRAV RUN EVENTS AND ONLY TURN UP TO TWO NOT ONLY DO THE OTHER RIDERS LOSE OUT ON FELLOW COMPETITORS,CROWD ENTERTAINMENT BUT THEYVE GIVEN THEIR DOLLARS OVER ALREADY.......HOWS THAT FOR THOUGHT? |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 23 Dec 2003 : 4:23:49 PM
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Keith, I'd like to see a class introduced into historic racing, with a 750cc limit. The gap between 500cc and 1300cc is too large and really you need to have a bike around 1000cc to be competitive in P4 unlimited.
The 750cc Pushrod Class is good, but I don't really see why 750cc XS Yamahas, and genuine CB750s and Z750 Kawasakis shouldn't be included.Apparently they run a 750 four stroke class in NSW. I suggest we should try to get Australia wide formulas for historic racing. |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 24 Dec 2003 : 03:05:59 AM
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As I've said before on this forum - I believe every bike racing in historic events should be eligible for one of the 'periods'. But the classes at normal meetings should run on capacity limits not periods, unless it's a championship. There's no reason why a fifties Vincent or Harley can't race a sixties 1100cc Honda, or a seventies 900cc Laverda or Ducati. The pre 72 bikes all run alky, post 72 - petrol!
What you end up with is an historic superbike race up to 1300cc, a historic Formula 750 race, a historic single cylinder 500cc four stroke single class, a historic 350cc single class, and classes for multis and two strokes. These could run at all meetings except championships.
Personally I like 'Heritage BEARS', I think it's great, but we can't change the fact that the Japs are part of motorcycling history!
The eligibility problems are a degenerative spiral. Too few bikes mean we run bikes together from the same periods, which are multis and singles, large and small capacity, two strokes and four strokes. There are many advantages to running bikes which are 'not of the era'! |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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